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February 01, 2006

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Andrew

One of the first things I recognized in reading Deleuze and Guittari was the insistent and consistent (intellectual) dishonesty of Zizek's drive-by use of Deleuze and Guittari. His characterizations of D & G are so sophomoric and flat-out wrong one would think he'd never read them at all. I'm certain he has, of course, but he's read them without reading them -- with all the interpretive charity a Holboan reading of Zizek, perhaps(?)

Deleuze's project is mostly pre-political and pre-personal; that is to say, it is ethical. As for Hardt and Negri's use. . . I'm still tarrying.

Sorry if all this is itself sophomoric, obvious, etc.

Jodi

Andrew, thanks for your comment. As you likely know, Zizek 'reads' Deleuze through Badiou. This isn't a criticism and only a defense in a very slight sense--he seems to feel ok with citing Badiou's critique and going on from there. In an interesting exchange with Dan Smith (I'll try to post it), Zizek says that Deleuze and Guattari have much in common with Jung in their approach to the Real. I don't know whether I buy that or not, which is why I'm trying to read Anti-Oedipus in as open a way as I can. Dan Smith says that Lacan taught the book and liked it. I'm still trying to see what I think of the notion of desiring-machines.

Keith

Zizek probably has a case for saying that about Jung. Somewhere in ATP, D&G make reference to him in one of their moves to dismiss Freud.

As for seeing "What The Bleep"...Be afraid. I happened to catch part of this 'film' when I went over to a friends a while back, and we all agreed it needed to be turned off. You are going to be disappointed - or perhaps you may experience some sort of enjoyment when it comes to the levels of critique you will be able to send that movie to the trash-bin through. Of course you feel you don't fit in! But you won't need pills when all you need to know is "what the bleep do I know?" Be prepared to see reality through the eyes of a supreme observer.

They do manage to slide the word "epistemology" into the film at one point.

Thanks for the Zizek/Smith posts - Anti-Oedipus is book that I should re-read (it's been almost eight years).

Andrew

I should haved qualified that I wasn't referring to Zizek's book on Deleuze (which I haven't read), but just to the anecdotal swipes he takes from time to time - thinking in particular of his oft-recycled bit about graphic pornography being quintessentially Deleuzian and _What is Philosophy?_ reinforcing the logic of global capital.

As for how/where Deleuze's work figures in relation to Lacan, this isn't a big concern of mine--and it's certainly not something I'm qualified to weigh in on.

marcegoodman

Jodi, I am glad you're back. I supposed that maybe you had grown weary from the last few rounds of posting and commenting and had decided to lay low for a while. Thanks for posting the Zizek/Smith exchange. I had been sufficiently tempted by your mention of the paper Daniel Smith delivered at the APSA to ask him for a copy myself but I hadn't heard back from him yet so I appreciate this. I'd still love to read that paper too.

Jodi

Hi Marc, thanks, yes, I'm in a low laying kind of mood right now--after binging on sitting at the keyboard to get the books done, and getting all manic in bloggy stuff, it seemed like a good idea. Dan Smith is a totally nice guy. He sent me his paper last Saturday (I googled him for his email address). The paper is good, similar to this one but not entirely so.

Craig

Turning away from Zizek to detox: the hardest part about going vegan is that the baked goods literally suck ass. And there isn't a decent cheese substitute. So, if you like cookies, cupcakes, or nachos, going vegan will be hard. We gave up, but we only use organic, free range milk and eggs now. Moderately better than growth hormone, locked in a tiny cage eggs and milk.

Andrew

"izek probably has a case for saying that about Jung. Somewhere in ATP, D&G make reference to him in one of their moves to dismiss Freud."

This is page 259 in the Becoming-Intense, Becoming-Animal chapter, at least in my copy.

I don't know Z says about this, but aren't representation, analogy, symbol, identity, etc, integral to Jung, and precisely the modes which D & G (want to)reject in their theorization and of assemblage, becoming-, affect, etc?

Andrew

A lot flubs in the above post, I see. Sorry.

Jodi

Andrew--there are a number of positive gestures to Jung in Anti-O. At least part of the point seems to be 'something deeper than' Oedipus.

Craig, I'm just going one step at a time at this point. I like soy milk, so that is one bit of dairy taken care of. I don't bake so that's easy. The big problem will be pizza. The kids are not particularly thrilled about the idea: my son says that within 2 months we will only eat soy powder.

Craig

Going vegetarian, I thought that the only things I'd be able to eat would be raw vegetables, but it turns out there is a lot more available out there than you would expect to the extent that the local chain grocery store (charmingly called 'Your Independent Grocer') in my town of a few thousand people carries a decent selection of meat substitutes. Chicken replacement technology is much more advanced than beef replacement technology, but then I was never much a fan of beef. And the various soy and lentil based burgers are much tastier than their beef counterparts. Even the infamous Tofurkey is quite good.

We tried making nachos or pizza once with soy cheese and it was repulsive. It appears that there is no adequate substitue for cheese at this time. And, like I said, vegan baked goods are better called vegan baked bads. I, personally, cannot live without cookies, cupcakes and donuts. So, like I said, we opt for the next best thing: organic and free range dairy -- which is unbelievably expensive in comparison to the factory dairy. I've never been a milk drinker, so that wasn't a problem, but I find soy milk even less appealing -- soy ice cream was a bad experience.

Much to the chagrin of my parents, I've become one of those people who harass servers to find out what the broth in the soup is. I suppose that is a good thing.

Keith

recently went googling for a few things and found this paper:
http://www.arts.monash.edu.au/cclcs/research/papers/docs/Unconscious-Subject.pdf

While I've only given it a cursory reading, it seems to tackle the whole Jung/Deleuze issue quite extensively. There is even a quote from Jung around '63 that has him comparing the individual to a rhizome, if you can believe that.

Acumensch

So are you still vegan? My friend is currently trying to show how me how easy it is to become vegan - but then I just had pizza last night and it just felt so right. I know it is consistent with my views to be vegan, but being vegetarian is so much easier for me, and I've been that for five years or so.

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